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NO Tiva please. They maybe great as co-workers and friends but they are too different personality-wise. Sexual attraction...is it even there...it takes more than sexual attraction to keep a relationship alive. I would like to see them sort out their feelings on past actions such as Michael Rivkin and Somalia, not admit to any underlying love for one another. I prefer the naval crime stories to soap -opera. NCIS is on top of the ratings because of these stories, the characters and their personalities, not because they are like every other show that starts up love-ins between the characters. I feel too much soap will kill this show off.

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Okay let see

Ziva blame Mcgee for killing the cop even though she did not have anything to back it up with she blame The kid dad for getting himself kidnap even though she was not looking at the full picture.

So why Kate was not perfect either is Ziva

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kate was only on for 2 seasons and she did her share of putting tony down.she chose to leave and ziva was born now she is going into her 8th season so she is doing something right.

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Michael, more than a few people have pointed out in various forums that as a profiler, Kate was pretty lousy. She failed to take out Ari when she had a chance to do so because he had "kind eyes". Gibbs was rightly sceptical, telling her that "eyes can lie." That kind of thinking played a part, albeit a very,very small one, in her death.

Your comments on Ziva are par for the course coming from you, and as such, really aren't worth commenting on at all. They speak more about you than they do about her.

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@SAM

But they are also two different type of Woman Kate was a profiler and a part of the team and work with them and respected them

Ziva was like a spoil rotten rich girl who though that oh I am a woman and always right and your a man and always wrong

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Actually Michael, I never really disliked Kate. Had no problem with her, and had she stayed I probably would have continued to have no problem with her, or at least no more than what I might sometimes have with any of them. I think that Ziva is a better, deeper, richer character than Kate, but it's possible that she would have developed more layers had Sasha stayed.

You are right, there are those who like certain characters and who don't like others.

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Just like there are people who don't like kate there are people who don't like Ziva

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Wow.....all this talk about Ziva being a Mary Sue, which I don't see of course! I have to agree with SAM, TPTB do have the upper hand and they clearly see that Ziva brings something to the show as well as with the other characters. She's here to stay, whether you like it or not. Also, there's nothing one-dimensional about Ziva, not in the least bit.

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@AJA And that's how you view the character and you have every right to hold and express that opinion. But it is clear that the show doesn't hold the same opinion of the character that you do and would disagree with your assessment of the affect that she has had on the show and the rest of the cast of characters. Indeed, they would argue the exact opposite. And as they have the whip hand here -- they are in charge of the show and the writing -- their views and opinions will prevail.

Your opinion of the character just backs up the opinion of the professor I mentioned the other day, Ann C. Crispin, who said that the "Mary Sue" term is used these days to simply put down characters that the people who use the term don't like, no matter whether the character is written well or not.

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My understanding is that in 1991 Gibbs went to war, his family was killed while he was away, he came back from the war and hunted down the murderer and went into a tailspin that lasted til Mike Franks coaxed him out of it. That doesn't seem all that implausible. As far as Ziva's Mary Sueness - You're right that it's a popular character type. I look at Ziva as sort of a cross between a comic book super hero and a soap opera tragedy queen. Neither of those types of characters appeals to me personally, but I understand that some viewers love these types. Add to this Ziva's nasty smug snark and the diminishment of Tony in order to accommodate super Ziva and my dislike increases. I resent how cheesy, unintelligent at times, and unimaginative the show has become in order to promote, above other deeper, more original and interesting characters, this rather over exposed, one dimensional character.




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