The Mentalist > The Mentalist Review: The Red List > Comments Page 2
Jane's character was formed by his carney environment, so his moral view is not necessarily mainstream. People in a traveling carnival set their own rules, police themselves by their own standards, and do not relate to outsiders except as marks. They have their own tutors for the children, no doubt extremely worldly wise, and that gets passed on. So Jane's boundaries are what they need to be for him, and his ethics are situational, so burying a scumbag alive was totally OK, while in Lisbon's mainstream view it was horrible (but, interestingly, Van Pelt approved - surely based on her being unbearably conned by a scumbag - she now understands Jane's desire for revenge). Jane's ethics are based on truth and reality, not social convention. He has an honest integrity in that he will do what he has to do and, if necessary, pay the consequences. RJ's philosophical blather has no depth, only a superficial narcissism. He kills because he likes to and he can. He wants to bring Jane down to his m
Episode quite boring and done very mechanically, it seemed the episodes of season 4. I hope they do not return to that level. Season 5 is still great, but this episode was pretty boring. The best: the list and Jane, and every scene where Jane is. When the episode is bad,the only thing interesting is to look at Jane. Mi Suspects: Mashburn and Kirkland
LIGHT A CANDLE AND HOLD A SEANCE!
Rationalgal, as much as we like getting involved with these character's we have to take a bird's eye view. Otherwise we will be taken in by the con! This show has taught me a great deal. Everything is not as it seems to be! I refuse to be manipulated in a manner that blinds me. Everybody is a suspect, until they are not! I love all that Baker is doing with his character, he is really working his magic! But, he is still on the list too! IF YOU DON'T....HEAR FROM ME AGAIN.....!
Continued- Jane appears to be super intelligent. Jane also has a real vengeful side. I love the Jane character, he's very loveable, charming, charismatic, sweet, loyal..... So is Red John! You are forgetting Jane killed a man that was not Red John, will he kill again and be wrong? Just like Jane in Flame Red, I see Jane! We seem to be letting Jane off the hook for some very bads things he's done. We are like Jane's relative's, I know my Janey would'nt do that! Until the writer's explain this, my brow will be raised! You can contain and control a lion but he is still a man eater!
Continued- Most people when tragedy strikes, go on with their lives. Why is Jane so hellbent? His education is mysterious for me too. He knows way to much. I understand that he is very intelligent but he displays formal education at times. He uses list order acronyms and menemonic's among other things. His extensive knowdge of hypnosis suggest formal training. He didn't learn this all by himself. His tragedy set him on the right path but you never know when he'll bite you. Who educated Jane and why does Jane not want anything to do with his family. All these things are hidden.
Rationalgal, The up front story for Jane is correct. BUT! The mystery for me is this; Jane came to the CBI after his family was killed and has said that he was using them to catch Red John. USING THEM! People get killed when they cross him and Red John has killed them for Jane. When Jane was talking to Rebecca and she told him that Red John killed so he could get the case back, (you have to watch closely) Jane had a slight grin on his face. This is rather mysterious for me. It could have meant he was happy to get the case back but I don't think given what happened that he should have done that.
Jennifer1, you are right, I was thinking the same thing! But you know like I know, you cannot watch this show and not do what we are doing. I do think that we stripped away a lot of the mystery behind the subplot. Everything we figured out was hidden and therefore msyterious. Now it's not! We can speculate all we want about who Red John is but we will never know until the writer's show us. I think we caught all the clues and we can now sit back and enjoy the ride again. It won't be as hard because we won't have over 100 episodes to go over. LOL! I still have some questions but I think season 5 will shed some light on that. I did find something interesting when I watched Fugue in Red. I KNOW! BUT I'M GOING TO PUT IT OUT THERE ANYWAY!
Continue: His worldview is reality based but understanding of the need people have (sometimes including himself) for fantasy to help escape the harshness of that reality. He accepts the truth even when it hurts, but is torn by his inability to accept it in the deaths of his family He will do that in some way at the end. Perhaps RJ's bio would be just the opposite, causing him to envy Jane. If we want to get into mythology, we can go into the biblical creation stories, where the serpent was jealous of Adam and Eve and sought to bring about their downfall, as RJ seeks to do with Jane. All myths are allegories aimed at telling us some truth about ourselves or the world. The Mentalist is allegorical, and beautifully done.
I don't see any mystery about Jane. He is the most fully developed character I've ever seen on TV. We know his carney background pretty well (lacking info only about his mother) and how he hated exploiting vulnerable people but accepted it as part of the only life he knew. He loved the fun part of carney life - the clowns and games, which shows in his joy at revisiting that life occasionally and in the childlike aspects of his character. He and Angels escaped the carney environment but he could not free himself from the desire for the fame and fortune being a psychic brought - perhaps because it was the only thing he knew how to do. Having a family brought great joy and the loss so devastated him that he became mentally ill and suicidal for about a year. He seeks freedom from the pain of that loss by seeking revenge. Perhaps because of his exposure to pure evil, he is kind to those who deserve kindness and merciless to those who harm innocent people. His worldview is reality based but
anitraward1: nothing more that I can think of right now but I can’t help but feel that there’s a connection with the name Roy Tagliaferro. Perhaps it’s too obvious and thus a dead end, as we only got to see Royston in one episode and don’t have much more to go on. @rationalgal: I agree Royston’s character is rather bland. I’ve also been looking at Cho differently. I think that with the rapid deployment team there’s more to it than possibly just a love interest for him. There are so many good ideas presented here and a part of me wants to stop the analysis and just sit back and enjoy the ride, but it’s so hard to do! :)
The real mystery is who Jane and Red John really are. Both their lives are hidden. We don't know the real backstory on either of them. We have to eat our vegetables before we can have desert! The writer's haven't even scratched the surface on Jane yet.
I think that when this long ride we have been on is over and the writer's stop the car and we open the door and get out; we are going to say OMG it was him.... I should have known! I believe Red John was a ordinary man that worked his way up. During this time he went through a huge transformation or had one fabulous makeover! ANYWAY! Red John's styles of killings seem to have changed from then to now. I believe it was because he was in transition during these periods. Now he is stable and becoming a master. Before I really got into the series I was only concerned about revealing Red John. I think the backstory may be the most important of all. I think it will reveal Jane's and Red John's lives and how they came to be. It's not just about the who of it. It's about the why and how of it as well. That is why Jane's past is so hidden.
Jane learned his skills by being born and raised in a traveling carnival environment and coming from a long line of carney people. He is extremely intelligent with a natural gift for "reading" people. He reads constantly, deeply and over a wide range of topics. He was reading Carl Jung at the end of Season 4. Jung wrote his ideas in what is called his "Red Book." (There we go again.) The Jung philosophy is pretty consistent with what Red John seems to believe. (Pure crap IMHO, but he's a serial killer, so can't expect much.) If Royston is RJ I would be disappointed because he's too uninteresting. That's not a good disappointment to have. We have no investment in him as viewers. We need to have a good cartharsis in seeing him brought down. Royston would be a yawner. OTOH Mashburn would be a bitter disappointment and that's not good either.
I don't think I'm going to be disappointed when Red John is revealed. Red John seems to be someone who was a working class person who worked his way up. His insanity has somehow transformed him or Red John had a fabulous makeover when he came into his fortune! ANYWAY! Red John has been a killer for a long time. His styles of killing have have changed probably because his was still in transition during these times. Once he is revealed they will also reveal Red John's back story and that by itself will be absolutely fascinating. More fascinating is the fact that Jane has known him the whole time!
Red John's vioce seems very strange as if he's hiding it. Why? Because it is something you can't change, it's like a finger print. If Red John talked in his normal voice Jane would recognize it!
Professor Moriarty was Sherlocks childhood math teacher and later went insane. Bret Stile did tell Jane he was acting like an apprentice of sorts. Professor Moriarty liked Sherlocks intelligence but was willing to kill him if necessary. Red John has a twisted affection for Jane and has had the opportunity kill him but has not. Jane and Red John share the same set of skills. Red John seems to be superior to Jane. They seem to have a Grasshopper and teacher relationship. Jane can't recognize Red John because he is now insane. They sill however share the same attributes and skills. I think Red John has gone through a radical transformation of sorts as not to be detectable to Jane.
Could it be possible that the person that trained Jane is Red John? Oh, wait a minute, a pupil, teacher rivalry. This idea sure keeps up w/ the Moriarty storyline! This could be a major clue!
Jennifer1, you present a good solid case. Do you have any other connectors? I haven't eliminatated anyone but I do have my main suspects at the top of the list! We did say that these rich bad guys run in the same little circles and it is not inconceivable that these two organizations are connected in some way. The writer's did not just accidentally present two organizations like this for no reason. Something to think about. What I want to know is where did Jane pick up his skills, who trained him? He never went to high school and so he probably didn't go to college. So who did he train under?
My 1st pick for Red John is Jane's father or a relative. I'm looking for connector's. Look at this RJ-PJ. Looking at all the tea drinkers. Guess what and it may be nothing but Cho drinks tea and he knows Blake. There are so many things to consider but I'm sure it can be narrowed down. I did discover that Visualize believes in the same philosophy as Red John and was referred as a brainwashing cult. Watch the episode the Red all Over. The Visualize cult member speaks the same dogma.
Plus, you make some good points about Mashburn but I love the Mashburn character and I refuse to believe he’s RJ! ;-)
Continued: They are both competitive and if many people consider Jane to be the best mentalist and hypnotist, wouldn’t that make Dr. Daniel jealous? Plus his name – Dr. ROYston Daniel. He played the victim in Russet Potatoes, and that’s one reason we would not suspect him.
@Rationalgal: as per your thoughts on who RJ is - that brings me back to my theory that RJ could be Dr. Royston Daniel from the Neurolinguistic Programming firm. Like Stiles, he has a huge following and is admired by his pupils and has the means to accomplish the things RJ does. He’s tall, energetic, the same age as Jane. The fact that he didn’t shake hands with Jane in the Russet Potatoes episode does not mean that they never shook hands in the past - perhaps when they were children but Jane does not remember him from back then (maybe Royston hypnotized Jane to not remember him). In Russet Potatoes Jane acknowledged that he was familiar with Daniel’s work. Dr. Daniel is charismatic and intelligent and is considered one of, if not ‘the best’ hypnotist in the field. I took an instant dislike to his character, as he’s arrogant and controlling, but isn’t Jane, albeit in a lovable way? lol. They are both competitive and if many people consider Jane to be the best mentalist a
I loved Fugue in Red it was pretty funny. My favorite quote was "PUT YOUR GAME FACE ON COCKROACH, IT'S GAME TIME." Why are they doing this anyway?
I own a VUDU account through walmart, they have season's 4 and all of the 5th season's episodes so far (9) for sale to view immediately at $1.99 a episode.I've had this account for a while and it's worth it! So if you want to get a jump start on season 5, here you go!
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