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Jane: This is Red John. Lisbon: How can you tell? Jane: Because when it's him I can feel it.
Rank: Recurring Character
January 23rd, 2013 5:28 PM
@huisclothes: Yeah the anniversary and Lisbon pondering her future are linked, the more this is about Lisbon pondering her future, the worse it is for us. Shows don't have characters ask these types of questions when the show is running on all cylinders, it's usually the opposite and signals such. But we'll see. Anyway to finish my other thought, we still don't have one big question answered and unfortunately I don't think we'll ever get a good answer: Where was RJ and that limo going to take Jane? Why, where, what, how, anything? What was the plan? I can't imagine it was to kill Jane, he's far too valuable for RJ, but they had already punished him with wanting to cut off his fingers, what was going to happen? I feel like we should be able to read something into this, but what?
January 23rd, 2013 5:26 PM
Good catch, huisclothes, I bet Lisbon's 10th anniversary is exactly why she reevaluates her place in CBI. Wonder if it makes her take a good look at Patrick? In the promo, it shows the team playing a joke on her for her 10th.
January 23rd, 2013 5:23 PM
Continued-Now an angry psychotic parent may punish their arrogent wayward child, oh, by, lets say murdering the childs whole family. And as parents do, after enough punishment may reach out to the child hoping to mend some fences. The child still being arrogent, angry and wayward may want to be a little spiteful towards the parent. Possily acting out or maybe even trying to make the parent believe they have changed when they really haven't. Many children behave this way! Now since the parent knows they won't ever be friends, but still loving their child, they monitor their child from afar. Always leting the child know they are not far way.
Rank: Recurring Character
January 23rd, 2013 5:20 PM
But why did RJ get rid of him? Just a situational thing, he was in the wrong place at the wrong time? I don't buy that. Was it perhaps because Wainwright didn't really value Jane and thought his antics outweighed what he contributed so he punished him for that(for those who think RJ is attracted to Jane this might not be unreasonable)? I see that as unlikely. To me, it came down to this, Wainwright interferred with Jane's life, had him fired, basically that's what set up his ruse, and most of all tried to take over the Red John case and really delve into it. As we Saw in season 2 with Bosco and Rebecca's rampage, that's not something RJ tolerates. The case, it has to be in Jane's hand, you have to give him the position and opportunity to do his thing, that's what amuses RJ, that's what makes this game fun for him. He has to be the one seeking RJ and there can't be any limits on his seeking.
January 23rd, 2013 5:20 PM
Wow, anitraward1, what a head spin your theory is. I don't know about the visualize angle, but I can sure see the resentment angle for Jane's father. Patrick was the whole show, the cash cow for Dad. In that way Dad treated Patrick like a mark, not an insider, used him, took his money, gave Patrick pocket change and headed out to Loserville. I'd be really curious to see what ever happened to the guy. Hard to say if he has fostered a resentment and hate for his son all these years. Seems too disorganized and weak to hold a course. But wouldn't that be the surprise attack of the season!
b&w&r, I agree with you that even if the next episode doesn't obviously further the RJ plot, there will be small but important tidbits dropped. I do have to say I'm ready for more than breadcrumbs for a change!
January 23rd, 2013 5:18 PM
@b&w&r i was wondering whether the promo was dull because everything else would have tipped their hand. i do think this episode is going to reverberate through the rest of the season. didn't know about a tenth anniversary for lisbon. is that how long she's been with the cbi? would imply she got promoted instantly. or maybe just as head of the unit? that's why she re-evaluates and contemplates her future>
@bonaduz ok. no methadone. i'll go cold turkey. bruno has sold another pilot to cbs. think it's about a woman lawyer. simon's a good actor and definitely has the legs for it, but i don't think that's happening.
Rank: Recurring Character
January 23rd, 2013 5:16 PM
Getting back to a discussion earlier, I have a hard time really judging Wainwright. All year I was convinced there was some Red John plot or connection with him. It turns out there was but for a long time everything seemed set up for him to be a Red John minion--he just seemed too uptight, earnest and professional for something not to be up. It clouded my judgment of him. The fact that it seems like he was really genuine is a hard idea to accept, it took a while after the opener(even after the finale I still held out an idea that we found out Wainwright had a secret past that tied to RJ). Looking back now, he did have a rod up his ass and as others's said, it was all about the CBI and their interests with him. He never quite tolerated the idea that Jane's value closing cases should be enough to put up with his semantics, the sacrifice @huisclothes described well with the 90 yr old model.
January 23rd, 2013 5:10 PM
@mimi:Simon was on Ellen for about 15 min. with one commercial break. They talked about his home in Australia, Birds and that Ellen wanted his address, because she is going down under! He said, that he just came back 2 weeks ago, but was ready to go back already again! She also got him to dance a little that "gangman style" dance - funny! They showed a short clip from the Mentalist, didn't talk about the show though. I'm sure it will be on youtube in a cupple of days! @huisclothes: PLEASE seek help before you take Methadone! It's just a show, lol!!!! Maybe Bruno Heller will come up with another show starring Simon Baker in the future - who knows. They seem to be tight together. @anitraward1: you gave me LOTS to think about - thank's!
Rank: Recurring Character
January 23rd, 2013 5:02 PM
@anitraward1: very interesting stuff, definitely beyond the realms of how I think. I agree with @huisclothes that the promo wasn't anything riveting--it appears to be another episode, but like I said earlier, I think the subtle details, the little bits of information come across this episode are going to be important later in the year. The Visualize-Red John connection by itself doesn't have to come across as a huge splash and generate waves but this could be the foundation of laying information for some far more adventurous and dramatic events later in the season. I'd be surprised if we come away from this weekend's episode not thinking it was important, if nothing else they are celebrating the 10 year anniversary for Lisbon, that's got to be symbolic and there might be a reason there doing that now(although we probably won't realize what it was until after the fact)
January 23rd, 2013 5:02 PM
@anitraward1. just read part 2 of your comment. so you are envisioning a red john connection. and the comments you cite from brett stiles could be interpreted in a daddy dearest sort of way. and this is the door jane is opening. the boy wonder has a genetic predisposition toward serial killer-y. whoa.
January 23rd, 2013 4:56 PM
@anitraward1 hmmm. jane and his father. very oedipal web you weave. was surprised your comment ended with him joining visualize. !!! thought you were going for a red john connection. the visualize thing is very interesting and clever. i like it. i always thought, jane would have just tossed money to the old man every month or in a one big wad. any sadness poppa might display upon losing his precious son (sounds like a dickens scenario or sasha baron cohen in les miz), was about money. jane's smart and practical. he would buy pop off and get on with his new life.
doesn't mean his father isn't an evil son of a bitch but he did seem like a real loser to me. like when he went off to play poker with the boys at the carnival, you know they were gonna hand him his ass.
the elder jane and visualize. wouldn't that be a kick in the head?
January 23rd, 2013 4:54 PM
Continued-A trait that could be triggered under some kind of extreme emotional stress? Soooo....Jane makes a comment about someone he knows. He said that person was lonely and sad. Hummmm......That person wipes out Jane's who family. Jane pretty much wiped out his father's family and business when he left and the killer, Red John, pretty much does the same thing to Jane! Tit for Tat! The killer leaves a note that starts with Mister, not Mr. Sometimes a parent may use a term like this when they are chastising a child for doing something wrong.
January 23rd, 2013 4:42 PM
Continued-A place to grow and indulge some of your better thoughts about the world you live in and the people in it! Bret Stiles did say that Jane was becoming quite the apprentice. The apprentice to who? It would imply that Jane may have worked with someone who trained him in something. It has been said that Jane acts just like just like HIM. Red John! When do people most make these kind of statements? How could two people who don't know each other have personality traits so close to each other without having ever met. Wait! They do know each other! Why would Bret Stiles say if you keep going you might open a door you won't be able to close? Was Mr Stiles referring to a personality trait?
January 23rd, 2013 4:26 PM
Continued-so Jane leaves, takes a wife and does well for himself. They both leave a lifestyle that would consider them marks. If you're not in, you are most definately out! Now Jane's father, a possibly divorced man may have some issues with women. There a strong possibly that he may not treat them very well! Now Jane leaves him down on his luck without a hand up. His father is lonely, sad and alone. The son he invested all his time in and groomed for the business, threw it back in his face was walked away. Jane's father could have become very angry about this and had a hard time letting Jane move on with his life. But being down on his luck he couldn't do anything about what his son did to him at that time. Now what is a father to do? He lost his meal ticket, purhaps Visualize would seem like a good place to get a leg up!
January 23rd, 2013 4:15 PM
@mim. re: your questions about cancellation, there are those of us who are more fluent in the internecine ways of networks and shows. i'm sure they will chime in. i seem to recall knowing that the mentalist had been re-newed in march of 2012 which may be like early acceptance to a university. could be wrong.
i don't think they're, in general, so very far ahead with scripts. one of my crackpot theories has been that they will design two endings, one for a finale-finale and one that will tee them up for season six. bruno has said that they would give him fair warning so he could wrap things up properly. hope i get fair warning so i can start taking the methadone.
January 23rd, 2013 4:13 PM
Entwife-remember Jane's father and how he treated the younger Jane? Jane and his father were in business together. In the episode Throwing Fire, Jane's father asked him if he was just going to walk away from their business and doubted if Jane could make without him. Now Jane's father was making him do things he didn't like or want to do. His father also seemed like a rather mean and vengeful person and treated Jane like dirt. Jane's father also had a desire to be rich. Could it be possible that Jane left his father high and dry? Left his father to struggle on his own. If you remember Jane was the whole show, The Boy Wonder! Jane was a showmen, a chip off the ole block!
January 23rd, 2013 4:00 PM
Bonaduz you're right, nothing wrong about it!its great innit?
I heard Simon would be on Ellen's show, I'm not from the us so cant watch it but I saw a short clip on their website, 3 minutes where he asks questions about OZ, is that all? or there is more? seems quite short..
January 23rd, 2013 3:14 PM
One more thing @mimi: Yes, we're all crazy - but isn't that the fun of it? It's winter, it's cold, it's snowing and we're sitting in front of the computer, talking about something we really like. What's wrong with that? :)
January 23rd, 2013 3:07 PM
@huisclothes:Yes, I have the previous 4 seasons on DVD. I bought them after watching the season 4 finale last spring and got hooked! But I haven't seen them 10 times - yet!lol!!! Smith - yes, I have seen some clips on youtube - yummie! Well, if the show continues, I'll maybe get to your level of knowlege sometimes - until then I just enjoy the comments of all of you, keep revisiting the DVD's and look foreward to this spring's new episodes (if they are the last ones, it will be even more exciting - I hope!)p.s. Simon was funny at Ellen today! Love his accent!
January 23rd, 2013 10:48 AM
*and dying for them to get together at the end.
I4d be really gutted if the show was to end this year and I do hope there won't be a sad or dramatic ending, other then a dead RJ of course..
January 23rd, 2013 10:46 AM
I havent read all comments here but wanted to ask, when will we know if it's the last season?
besides, how do they do that? I mean they have to record, and mainl write the episodes in advance, what if they intended to release 6 or 7 seasons? then they have to rewrite everything? let alone replay some of the episodes? have no idea how it works.
now about the show itself, I have to say I'm totally hooked as well and wonder if I'm normal lol, I mean I would never have thought that one could be so fanatic about a series, see what I mean? I have watched all seasons in a very short time after seeing a cliffhanger episode, I got hooked straight away and now that I have seen them all, I'm rewatching them, fortunately I forgot how it ends for some of them. I'm never bored and I love everything about the show, I love the characters, how they really car for each other, they are all moving in their own way, then I love the relationship between jane and Lisbon and am dying for them to get toge
January 23rd, 2013 4:02 AM
just saw the promo for the red barn. nothing in there that looks like it's going to be a blockbuster.
January 23rd, 2013 3:32 AM
@ bonaduz. i think most in this group love the series. we know so much about the episodes and we have such high expectations that we probably put as much time into an episode as the writers do. i too think they do a great job i would be happy if the search for red john lasted through yet another season but we're hearing rumors that this may be its last year. i imagine you've got the first four seasons on dvd. did you watch them all before seeing this season? i've seen every episode at least ten times. one more thing, there's a short lived tv show called smith - simon is a bad ass surfer who seems to solve everything with a rifle. he is gorgeous in that show. within this group it's looking like i'm the booster for patrick and don't want to change a hair on his greek god of a head. i am terrified that to be cool they'll have to give us an end in which everybody dies and everyone who doesn't die wants desperately to do so.
January 23rd, 2013 2:46 AM
hi km. been musing over your musing. jane's memory palace i always took as a mnemonic device- the kind of thing that memory experts employ. to mean more, i think it would have to have been already depicted in some way (dream-like sequence or collage or something) - hard to put it across.
regarding red john being someone patrick worked under or knew back in the day, that's interesting. someone to whom jane was apprenticed. i've always thought about jane's father with that great evil grin. but once again. he turned up in season two and then disappeared. connecting all the dots would be difficult.
yes, jane is told by sophie that's it's his choice to give up or live. that red has to be blood.
January 23rd, 2013 2:11 AM
Thank you rationalgal and huisclothes for your filmology on Simon Baker. I'll definitly try and get all the movies you suggestet! I also hope, the Mentalist will stick around for another season but I understand the dilemma the writers are in - not knowing if it will be renewed puts them in a tough spot. The writers have to take a lot of criticism from all sides, but all in all I think they do a good job. It's not easy to keep the standard over 4,5 or 6 years! I also find it interesting to see the different styles of the directors and I pay a lot more attention to details since I'm watching the show (also watching movies and other TV shows). A fascinating genere that keeps us busy, talking, laughing and crying or all toghether!