All this Buffy talk needs to stop

Now I have nothing against BTVS but I would prefer to read more about the love for the show and less about BTVS

Thats your problem. Various opinions exist. Not everything about TVD is fine nice and dandy. TVD has a lot of flaws and problems. Its only fair to compare to the show that made it all start and set the standards for quality tv shows. :)

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New info on S3 Elena

Also yay for another thing one  can compare with buffy (anyone remember Buffy's birthday in season2? :P)

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New info on S3 Elena

Vampire Diaries fans, mark your calendars for September 15. That's The CW drama's third-season premiere — and a special day for Elena Gilbert (Nina Dobrev). "Our first episode is Elena's 18th birthday," spills exec producer Julie Plec. What's in store for the birthday girl?"There will be a small time jump [from where last season ended] as we celebrate Elena's birthday," says Plec. "But as is the pattern in Mystic Falls, the event never reaches its climax." Elena will now be a senior in high school, but don't bank on a season-ending graduation.Now that she's 18, "Elena and Jeremy technically don't need a parent living in their house [following Aunt Jenna's death]," says Plec. "She will be taking care of herself."On the romantic front, might the show now capitalize on the real-life romance of Nina and Ian Somerhalder (Damon) and have their characters hook up? While Plec stresses she would never exploit her actors' personal lives, she hints that "over the course of the season, Elena will be struggling with a deep, deep attraction toward Damon. That's going to be a big problem for her." As will Rebecca, a yet-to-be-cast vampire from Stefan's "darkest ripper days who loves that Stefan's back to his bad behavior." She's not the only one.

 

 

So, let's see:

- We know at least on the size of timeskip.

- another new cast member. ENOUGH ALREADY, use the ones you already have instead of introducing and killing 452745 new ones.

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Zap2It Spoilers!

One can start hoping for that the moment they allow Damon to be right for at least one second :/

 

I would not be surprised if he after going good would turn into even more caring and noble Stefan...

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Zap2It Spoilers!

I woul dhav eloved if it went this way instead:

 

The season ould start right after the finale ended. the first half of season would be split between scenes with stephanus/klaus/etc and elenaholics.

On one hand we would have Stephan(us) descent into the dark, a psychological kind of story of how he goes through it all and what he causes, giving us a nice decent look into his mind.

On other hand we would have elenaholic gang developments. How Jeremy/Alaric/Elena mourn jenna and john, how Elena deals with the fact she KILLED her last two parental figures with her foolishness, how damon deals with the fact that stefan's gone, how jeremy reacts to the ghosts, how and if liz/caroline mend their relationship, who becomes the guardian of jeremy and the legal process of it, who pays the rent/bills now,  did elena NOT get thrown out of school for zero attendance, how elena deals with teh fact SHE GOT FUCKING KILLED. and so on.

 

Instead we skip that all to get into usual tvd hijinks and romance plotline bla blas.

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Zap2It Spoilers!

The tracking spell will only tell them where Stefan is. It will not tell them what he is doing or that he is a ripper, they will need to go to where he is to find that out.

Ripper or not it does not matter.

The ripper thing is placebo to tell us all that Stefan is not there and we have Stephanus. Its a mcguffin plot thread to separate him from cast. Usually that would be used to develop the characters.

 

Obviously with the timeskip and all, thats not the case and they will skip to romance stefan's back and he is eeeevil angst.

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All this Buffy talk needs to stop

But when it comes to the point where it's ALL we see on the board and people INSIST on shoving it down people's throats, then it just becomes unneccesary.

 

When argument is made, comparison is made. Anything that has to do with Elena, characters, timeline, etc can be compared to prove a point and most likely will be.

 

Its unavoidable and it will always happen and its  given. What will never be done and was never done(just like halde said) is discussions about BTVS in pure tvd threads :)

 They say Buffy is a better show like it is a fact or something.

Except that, well, it is a fact. It has a cult following, strong legacy, there would be no tvd without it, it has academic following and critical praise of levels TVD will never get and it is impacting and affecting everything released since it started airing.

Just like classics like homer's odyssey, thus spoke zarathustra or robisnon crusoe are better than tvd books and thats a fact, same with btvs and tvd.

BTVS is a standard of quality tv. Its depth is unrivaled by the shows of its length, it has made the rules and so on.

 I think the actors are better, the characters are much likable and the storylines are better.

Any arguments for that? Because thats not an opinion. thats a statement. I can go around saying "hey, earth is flat, but thats just my opinion".

There are quality standards, universal properties of what is art, what is not and what is kitsch. It has nothing to do with opinions.

Opinion is LIKE/DISLIKE.  This has nothing to do with that.

Honestly I think it’s a bit arrogant to say that Buffy is on a higher level then TVD you think it’s better not the whole world.

Not arrogant as its backed up by factual arguments. it is arrogant to claim its an opinion, tbh.

TVD is entertaining tv show. No doubt about it. But its not complex, its not too deep, its not realistic. Its not art and it won't have an impact BTVS did.

TVD is entertainment, ala hollywood movies and other stuff. BTVS is art.

 And secondly why compare The Vampire Diaries when they only got two seasons so far? Buffy had 7. Doesn’t seem much more reasonable to compare the show after a few seasons. Not just two???

Hence why comparisons were made only to the first two/three btvs seasons so far :) plot wise Character wise if character has been developed in the wrong way, giving the show few more seasons won't fix that or bring that up to level of the thing you are comparing to.

And no one is comparing season by season. Thats just unfair for TVD.  Comparisons and allusions are made to characters to reinforce the points and mostly the first few seasons are used.

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All this Buffy talk needs to stop

@Halde

Did i almost just solve a issue:OOO?

Nah, you just pointed out the obvious, reiterating everything constructive that was said in this thread

 

In few hours this thread will be flooded by those who will say that any sort of comparison to BTVS is heresy :P

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Zap2It Spoilers!

Since Klaus and Stefan have left town, how are they supposed to find out about ripper Stefan? It's not like it is going to be in the newspaper, or nightly news. All they will know in Mystic Falls is that Stefan left town with Klaus.

Which is exactly the thing they should reacto to. Cue character development that was skipped.... :[

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All this Buffy talk needs to stop

I also think that they are not alike, tbh i never even thought of buffy while watching tvd, untill all the comparing started on this forum a while ago. Of course they are both vampire shows but other than that, the story's are very different.

 

Story might be different.

 

Whedon is pure feminist. Females in his shows matter and have very wide array of storylines. They are allowed to have roles beyond the usual romance.

 

TVD takes a whole lot more misogynistic approach.  Females are constantly threated as romance-objects or something that needs to be protected. Even Katherine, TVD's local badass female with many personality traits being based on Buffy, has suffered from that through the second season.

 

Story-wise, i covered it already. BTVS takes a real-world approach - you have a timeline, and multiple storylines that crash and clash with each other, sending each other to different directions, affecting each other. It bassically covers the eight years of the character cast lives, sorrows, deaths and conflicts, with everything slowly leading towards the ending, with every plot thread being built up. Its not a happy world, its not a story. Its a real messed up broken world with a lot of injustice, darkness and pain.

TVD takes more unrealistic, book/romance-novel appraoch of no set timeline and one major storyline with everyone else being sidelined. Just like with romance novels, the show either develops story or characters.

 

Character-wise there are obvious similarities between characters, however what differs is how the shows handle them.

TVD characters are characters. They exist to forward the story forward. There is a clear moral compass everyone should follow, supporting cast is just there to develop[ the  main one and so on. ALso characters, main characters seem to never suffer consequences of their actions or actually be regarded as negative.

BTVS in this case had, yet again, more realistic approach. There was bad bad bad stuff existing out there and then there was a whole lot of gray and no pure white in the morality. viewers would discuss, question and wonder about the character decisions. Characters themselves were never sure that what they will do is for actual good.  Also characters were a lot more polarizing. There was no pure white. Everyone(especially Buffy) had their own skeletons in the closets, their own "masks" they wear, their own kinds of hypocrisy. Characters would have to accept the consequences of their actions and live with that for all their lives. Nothing could be solved fast and easy and problems, just like real life ones, would remain, build up, explode.

 

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So yeah, by that to sum up, while the essence of the shows is different(BTVS being deeper, more realistic, etc), there are certain things one can compare in order to argument their opinions. For one, TVD used a lot of BTVS plotpoints and scenes(pretty much identical) for two, both shows have the same source of inspiration(Tvd books), for three, they have same character archetypes in the main cast. For Four, BTVS is the progenitor of all the vampire craze and the show that gave the roots and standards to quality tv.

 

So yeah. comparing to argument is fair. comparing the shows on whole is unfair for TVD, since BTVS is way superior to TVD.

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