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Supernatural Round Table: Season 9 Premiere

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Supernatural is back!

And so is the Supernatural Round Table!

Following this week's premiere of Season 9, in which it was clear the brothers have plenty more work to do, TV Fanatic staff members Carissa Pavlica, Carla Day and Sean McKenna - along with Alice from Winchester Family Business - have gathered around their Round Table to debate the best scenes from "I Think I'm Gonna Like It Here," Sam as a coma patient and a lot more.

Join in the discussion now...

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What was your favorite scene from the Supernatural Season 9 premiere?
Carissa: I don't think I had a favorite scene. I was happy overall to learn that the fallen angels had their grace on earth. It would have been awful to learn they fell and lost everything.

Alice: It's a tie. The scene between Sam and "imagined" Dean outside the cabin, when Sam decided it was time to let go. If only the real Dean had seen that! I guess if he had though there would be no desperate deal, Sam would be dead, and the show wouldn't have been as interesting. Still, my heart breaks over Sam's plea, "It's what I want." The poor guy deserves some peace.

The second scene is when Sam makes Death promise that if he dies, he stay dead. I was so stunned, and very proud that Sam didn't want any more trickery. He was ready to go. Plus Julian Richings as Death rocks. 

Carla: Dean's prayer or really his pleas to the Angels was heartbreaking to watch. He wasn't willing to let his brother die and instead of a deal with a demon which Sam would have hated, Dean turned to Angels. It may not have a much better outcome, but ... let's hope.

Sean: I enjoyed Dean's prayer. He was putting it all out there to save his brothers even if at the back of his mind he knew, there might be consequences. I felt for the brother choosing to call any and all angels. Plus, it also furthered the concept of all the fallen angels out there and the new journey for the season isn't going to be an easy one.

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What did you think of Sam’s thought process in the coma?
Carissa: I wasn't very happy with his resignation. He was just ready to give up and let it all end as long as nobody else was going to be in pain, etc., at his hands. That sounded good in theory but he wasn't thinking about how important he was to the cause at hand or the moment he left. Leaving Dean just as all the angels fell to earth was a bit of a cop out, no matter his rationale.

Alice: Sam is a very smart and perceptive guy. I'm thrilled he was thinking everything through with maturity and clarity. He even had imagined Dean punching him! He also remembered the past deals and how much people get hurt when he comes back. It was natural and rational and it shows how much Sam has grown. 

Carla: It was difficult to watch Sam so willing to give up. That didn't seem like the Sam that we have known. If he didn't want to live, he would have gone through the trials and it would be a much different world. He wanted to live. It was a good and believable way for Bobby to return.

Sean: Sam has been through so much and getting both sides of the argument in his head felt like the logical way to go. And on the one hand I understand wanting to go and be done, especially after last season finale's emotional and physical breakdown about screwing everything up. I'm just glad he was able to see his brother needed him and there was still work to be done. Their journey isn't over.

Which do you like more: Castiel as an angel or Castiel as a human?
Carissa: I just love Cas. He is an angel and I can't imagine the pain he is going to feel knowing he is unable to help in the way he has traditionally been able. That's going to be tough to watch. As much fun as it was watching him bumble around last season, I think it will be less enjoyable this season. I'd prefer his grace be returned. Plus, I'm going to miss that trench coat!

Alice: To be honest, I'll take Castiel either way. Just the mere fact there will be more Castiel this year and Misha Collins is back to being a regular is good enough for me. The human thing will be really fun to watch though.  He's still hopeful there are good things he can do on earth. He just needs to learn he can't combine whites and darks when doing laundry.    

Carla: I don't know if it's a matter of liking one better than the other. I do like the idea of seeing Cas dealing with being human. It's even more of an adventure for him since some Angels are after him. He's lost his Grace, his abilities, and now he's a liability for the Winchesters. This combination should make for a compelling story.

Sean: I like Castiel period. He's done so much as an angel, and stripping him of his grace and turning human should prove to be another interesting side to his character. Plus, it's going to be tough fighting off other angels who still have powers. I do wonder if the trench coat is gone for good?

What did you think of Dean convincing Sam not to die, but not telling him about Ezekiel?
Carissa: If it gave Sam life, then it works. They've always had secrets from each other, and this one is definitely one he needs. Even the doctor said it's in God's hands, and now, clearly, Sam is in the next best thing since the door to heaven is sealed.

Alice: I thought it was a horrible thing to do, but then again, it was in character.  He said it best, "There ain't no me if there ain't no you."  By not telling Sam though, he took the decision away from his brother, a decision he knew Sam wouldn't make, and that doesn't sit well with me.  But Dean was desperate, and he's already drowning in guilt so what's a little more?  Oh hell, it's going to eat him alive.  That's what makes good drama!

Carla: He acted in a very Winchester manner. He couldn't risk Sam refusing Ezekiel's help. Throughout the years, we've seen that they aren't complete without the other. And, there's a war going on. Dean will need Sam to save the world ... once again.

Sean: It was true Dean in that impassioned speech to save his brother and convince him to not die. Sure, the Ezekiel secret will probably blow up in his face, but for now it's helping fix Sam. The brothers are clearly meant to fight on together and it was the last resort.

Is Ezekiel possessing Sam a good thing?
Carissa: Yes. Unless I misunderstood, his plan is to gain strength while in Sam and then heal him from within and eject himself when Sam is recovered. Sam will undoubtedly recognize Ezekiel, as this isn't the first time he's been to the possession rodeo. He'll and try to rebel, but he'll get over it. At least he's not going to be hearing the voice of Lucifer in his head. Like he said at the end, "we've got work to do."

Alice: Define good. Sure, it's good in that he's the only thing keeping Sam alive.  But it's also really bad because remember Hael's double cross of Castiel?  Why do I have this feeling that a few months down the road, when the angel situation gets really out of control, Ezekiel is going to step forward as the new leader in his strong, freakishly tall, long-hair-flowing-in-the-breeze Winchester vessel?  Dean is going to get burned by this, I tell ya!  This is Supernatural after all. 

Carla: Is it good? I'd say no, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's a bad thing. Dean took a chance to save his brother and made the best decision that he could given the circumstances. We'll have to wait to see whether it turns out to be a good thing or not.

Sean: It's good in the sense that it is helping fix Sam. It's also kind of cool to see Jared Padalecki play another version of his character. I agree with Alice about feeling like down the road when Ezekiel gains his strength back that things are going to go horribly wrong and the "helpful" deal might backfire. Can they really trust angels? Can they really trust a deal to be so simple? I'm looking forward to seeing where it all goes.

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another word limit thing. the rest of the sentence was if zeke is as good a soldier as cas indicated, then zeke would want strong allies, smart allies, allies who can convince cas if necessary to become a vessel for zeke, or at the very least want to be allies with the two individuals who have a bunker of info and have their hands on both the angel tablet and the prophet who can translate it.

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i'm not really worried about a sam takeover as i believe carver made it very clear that if an angel rejects it's vessel it can be ejected. if indeed zeke does in fact decide to do a double cross of some sort, i don't believe it'll have anything to do with taking over sam. if anything, i can see ezekiel wanting cas. what better way to infiltrate heaven and take out metatron then to use cas to do it. he's been to heaven after all, he knows the battlefield, and metatron wouldn't be afraid of cas as he's human, so what better place for zeke to hide .... still though, i think zeke is what he says and he will need the help of both boys in the future. that mutual benefit zeke referred to could go deeper than just healing both him and sam. he could have meant that by healing sam, having sam's gratitude, having sam strong, would be more beneficial to zeke than not...having two winchesters as his ally and in his favor over one. if he's the good soldier cas believes him to be, he would want strong allies...smart allies, allies with vast knowledge and angel tablets...he'd want the winchesters.

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i never saw it as sam giving up. the very fact that dean was in his head as the "fight" indicates to me that sam indeed wanted to live. i think bobby who represented "acceptance" and not "surrender". sam is a logical being, and he kept asking dean what the "plan" was. dean replied he was working on it. that means he didn't have a solution. just because sam started to accept his fate, that he is in fact dying, doesn't mean it's what he wanted. but if he was going to go, he wanted to make sure noone, dean, can ever reverse it and end up getting hurt. as soon as dean arrived, and i think it was the real dean, with a plan, sam chose life. he had absolute faith in his brother and his own ultimate decision was to live. he could've gone with death regardless, but chose not to.

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Poor Sam. I felt so sorry for him. He's exhausted, battered down by life and at the end of his tether. No wonder he wanted some peace. I'm certainly not going to knock him for it.
Favourite scene - the 'there ain't no me if there ain't no you' line. I think it was the real Dean there, that somehow Ezekiel connected Dean to Sam, like a tin can and string kind of thing with Ezekiel being the string. Also loved Sam's chats with Death although they broke my heart at the same time.
Not a fan of Castiel so not bothered whether he's human or angel.
I thought it was an excellent season opener.

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Who would want to be Sam Winchester this has been going on since Mary made the deal that sealed Sam's fate before he was born. But still this is Sam's life so anything goes whether Sam likes it , wants it , needs it or asks for it. Just waiting for the big pear shaped object looming over the horizon and smacks both Dean and Sam in the face.

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sorry for the multiple comments, should've remembered character count limits, part 3:
Dean's a complicated character with many different facets to his nature, his love for Sam isn't all that defines him. Not sure if it was Zeke or Dean who said "there ain't no me if there ain't no you." I actually don't find that line affirming of the brother bond, it seems to point to how little identity Dean feels he has outside of Sam. But I thought Zeke was posing as Dean. He's inside Sam's head and could recreate Sam's inner Dean. It made me think of Lucifer posing as Jess in S5. Either way, Sam is still responding to the Dean (so he thinks) in his head, and maybe seeing Dean's desperation is what made Sam say yes.

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Sorry, here's the rest of my comment:
Also I loved how Sam's love for Dean showed, in his conditions for Death, and I think in his motivations for consenting to being saved. He didn't want to leave Dean to fight on alone. Cas as human or angel: Cas in any flavor, please (except Godstiel, I didn't like that) and the more the better! I really enjoyed the Castiel scenes, watching him discover his humanity. Dean's decision: I love Dean and understand why he'd do this (and yes there'd be no show if Sam died so something had to be done to save him). But Sam gave an uninformed consent, so the possession is non-consensual and Sam's going to be upset. My other concern is that while Sam seems to have grown, is Dean thrown back into the same damaging, hurtful cycles, over and over? I hope this story is used to examine Dean's issues and move the character forward. I'm sure there will be interesting fallout. That Dean loves Sam more than anything isn't in. But that's not all that should define Dean, who is a complicated character with many different facets to his nature. Not sure if it was Zeke or Dean who said "there ain't no me if there ain't no you." I actually don't find that line affirming of the brother bond, it seems to point to how little identity Dean feels he has outside of Sam. But I thought Zeke was posing as Dean. He's inside Sam's head and could recreate Sam's inner Dean. It made me think of Lucifer posing as Jess in S5. Either way, Sam is still responding to the Dean (so he thinks) in his head, and maybe seeing Dean's desperation is what made Sam say yes.

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Interesting round table! I thought 9.01 was one of the stronger season premieres, it was riveting, but there are some unsettling aspects. Hopefully the season will unpack it all in a satisfying way. Favorite scene: has to be Dean outside Sam's hospital room, battered by angels but effectively telling them to shove it. We know how Dean puts Sam first but he isn't going to hand Cas over either, even though the angels were threatening Sam. Dean defended them both, he was defiant and resourceful. That was awesome. Sam's thought process: I felt sad for Sam. He can see a life beyond just hunting and dying bloody, he's also been through so much and seen the costs of doing crazy sacrifices to save your loved ones, and done it himself. He's ready to go peacefully. I agree a little that Sam also seemed a bit defeated--I'm not sure how much Sam was ready to go peacefully, as that Sam was a little too ready to give up. Undecided on that. But I think he was ready to go. Also I loved how his love for Dean showed, in his conditions for Death, and I think in his motivations for consenting to being saved. He didn't want to leave Dean to fight on alone. Cas as human or angel: Cas in any flavor, please (except Godstiel, I didn't like that) and the more the better! I really enjoyed the Castiel scenes, watching him discover his humanity. It was very character driven and good to have such a careful, up-close look at him. Dean's decision: I love Dean and understand why he'd do this (and yes there'd be no show if Sam died so something had to be done to save him). But Sam gave an uninformed consent, so the possession is non-consensual and Sam's going to feel violated when he finds out. My other concern is that while Sam seems to have grown, is Dean thrown back into the same damaging, hurtful cycles, over and over? I hope this story is used to examine Dean's issues and move the character forward. It's hard, this far in, to see the character continue to be so mired, it's heartbreaking and not in the best ways. But there's going to be consequences and fallout and I think it will be a good story. Dean loves Sam more than anything, we know this, and that's not in question. But that's not all that should define Dean, who is a complicated character with many different facets to his nature. I'm not sure if it was Zeke or Dean who said "there ain't no me if there ain't no you." That line bothered me. I just don't find it affirming of the brother bond, there are better ways to do that, instead it seems to be about just how little identity Dean thinks he has outside of Sam. But it seemed like Zeke was posing as Dean, and the way he morphed from Dean to Zeke made me think of Lucifer posing as Jess in S5. Either way, Sam is still responding to the Dean (so he thinks) in his head, and maybe seeing Dean's desperation is what made Sam say yes?