What will become of Crowley? Will we see Abbadon again? How did you feel about the brotherly bonding?
Yes, Supernatural Season 8 may be behind us, but "Sacrifice" gave Round Table participants Carla Day, Carissa Pavlica, Sean McKenna and Alice Jester (of The Winchester Family Business) plenty to discuss and analyze.
So pull up a virtual chair now and join in below!
What was your favorite scene or quote from the finale?
Carissa: Sheesh. Tough as always! I'll have to go with Crowley crying and asking Sam where he would start, to repent, when he has been so horrid for so many years. Like he was saying, how does the king of hell go about asking for forgiveness? Mark Sheppard did an amazing job showing his range with that scene and I really felt for Crowley. That's an amazing feat!
Carla: “Girls. You’re my Marnie, Moose. And, Hannah, she just needs to be loved. She deserves it. Don’t we all? You, me, we deserve to be loved. I deserve to be loved! I just want to be loved.” Crowley was hilarious here and it was an emotional side we haven't seen before. I'd love to see more of this more humanized Crowley. Plus, a Girls joke that works? That's a big win!
Alice: I’ve got two favorite scenes, both equally epic. The first one is the brotherly talk, but I’ve given my thoughts on that scene in question #4 (wibble). The other is the scene between Crowley and Sam, when Crowley was at his most vulnerable. This scene is so unlikely, given Sam and Crowley’s adversarial history, but both are so worn down and broken, that they actually share a moment. Crowley is suddenly calling Sam by his name instead of “Moose” and he genuinely shows regret when asking Sam where to start when confessing his sins. Sam offers hope in the injection, but he’s so weak he can barely administer it, so Crowley stretches out his neck for him. Both Mark Sheppard and Jared Padalecki just blew me away with their deep emotional delivery in that scene.
Sean: There were so many good scenes and moments this episode, it was so hard to choose. From Crowley and Sam, Dean and Sam, the Metatron betrayal, and more. But it was watching Dean carry Sam outside only to witness the spectacularly visual scene of the angels falling from Heaven. I was not expecting it from a story stand point, and seeing it was a shockingly cool way to leave me craving season 9.
What's to become of Crowley now that he's been humanized?
Carissa: Well, it seems Castiel has become humanized as well, they're both so smart witted and quick to think on their feet, they would be a very awesome duo to join Sam and Dean on whatever new fight they will be fighting next season. And, let's face it, they're both going to be pissed as hell. No pun intended!
Carla: Crowley's humanization status is still up in the air. The procedure wan't complete, so what does that mean? Will he be a humanized demon? Or, will he go back to his normal evil self? I'd love to see him remain partially humanized. It would allow Mark Sheppard to really grow the character.
Alice: While I like to think this experience would profoundly change him, since Sam didn’t finish the cure he’ll eventually go back to his old ways, crankier than ever. Of course, he’s going to be busy facing opposition from Abaddon or the other demons that didn’t come to his rescue, especially since they’ve seen how he can be weakened. Part of me would love to see Sam go back into the church and finish the cure in the season nine premiere, just so he can be walking on Earth as a human with Castiel.
Sean: Crowley was close to being cured, but it was never completed right? I've got a feeling that things are going to change for the King of Hell, and probably not for the better at least in terms of power status. Will he ever find a way to be evil again? Either way, it's pretty definite that Mark Sheppard is going to nail any incarnation of his devilishly entertaining character.
Will Abbadon return?
Carissa: It seemed to be set up that that was the plan, but I was kind of lost by the end of the hour. I have absolutely no idea what to expect. I would say the sky's the limit, except that seems to be the one place off limits right now as the angels have fallen out like roasted marshmallows.
Carla: Absolutely. When Abbadon was beheaded so quickly earlier in the season I was a bit bummed. The actress is awesome and the character had such great potential. I didn't realize they kept her around, so when the boys sewed her back together I was thrilled. I'm looking forward to the return of Abbadon. New big bad?
Alice: Oh yes, and she will take control of Hell. It’s obvious that Crowley doesn’t have any loyalists, and demons will probably want to follow a fearsome Knight of Hell rather than a salesman. I do wonder what the new vessel will be like, but she’ll be back and very likely a major player.
Sean: She has to, although I kind of wish it was the same vessel coming back. Or maybe it is? That said, I think she's a worthy potential for new big bad although I hope that if it is a new actor or actress, they are able to fill the shoes and pull off Abbadon convincingly.
Sam admitted his greatest sin was letting Dean down. What did you think of their heart to heart?
Carissa: Fine, Sean, fine. I cried. And the funny thing was my sister and I were watching and she turned to me and said (we were just crying to each other an hour earlier) WHO DO THEY SOUND LIKE?! Because there is something very penetrable about the bond of siblings, and the unawareness from the other that the feeling of letting each other down exists. It never occurs to the one is is supposedly being let down, yet the pain can be tearing the other apart. Jared Padalecki tore that scene up. It was a finale of extremely great acting. I hope Sam letting that out and Dean understanding how Sam felt draws them closer next season.
Carla: The Winchesters need to let their walls down a bit more often. While it creates epic moments like this conversation, they have been together long enough that they should be more honest and open with each other. It would strengthen their overall relationship and partnership. Though, I loved the moment. It was a long time coming.
Alice: I have a new favorite brotherly scene of all time. Sam is so closed and swallows everything that hits him, so we never really know what’s truly going on inside. To see him in this exhausted and worn to the core state, where his emotional vulnerabilities were open for everyone to see, I had no idea how bad his past failures with Dean impacted him. All those years of swallowed pain were just killing him inside and he was willing to die for it. It took him being on the brink of death to finally bring all that out in the open. Of course Dean was the only one that could bring him back from that point. Their hug wasn’t no ordinary hug, it was Sam clinging onto his brother for dear life, taking in the healing from Dean. I get weepy every time I see it.
Sean: We see so many Sam and Dean moments, but this was an outstanding emotional scene between the brothers. It was raw, real, and full of open sentiment. I believed in everything Sam said as he struggled to get Dean to trust him at the same time that Dean was able to convince his brother just how important he is. This is probably one of my favorites scenes between the brothers and I loved that Sam didn't complete the trial but rather listened to Dean. Them leaving together, as exhausted and rundown as they were, was a great moment to bring them back on the same page as a team. I hope that extends when we come back next fall.
What did you think of Castiel losing his grace?
Carissa: I suppose it means we're going to see a lot more scenes similar to the one of him in the convenience store. He's going to be like a deer caught in the headlights. He was human, I believe, for a very short period before remembering he was an angel, but he forgot that life fairly quickly. He'll have so much to learn and he's going to feel even worse than Sam when it comes to letting people down. He let down the world. Heaven is closed, whatever that mean. How does a lost angel recover from that?
Carla: Sad. Castiel has been all over the place through the seasons. I'm surprised his host body has deteriorated by now. Though, Castiel without Misha Collins wouldn't be Castiel. If anything, I'm dismayed that once again Castiel is going through a big change like this.
Alice: The poor angel, or ex-angel I should say. He just doesn’t learn. He didn’t listen to Dean again, and it bit him again. Although, Metatron would have tracked him down eventually, but Castiel made it too easy by showing up in Heaven and letting Metatron finish his spell. I liked seeing Castiel struggle as a fallen angel in season five, so I’m fascinated by the idea again for season nine. This opens up some amazing new possibilities for his character.
Sean: It's a bummer he rushed headlong into a trap, but Castiel being human will be interesting to see. Will it make him want to be human or return to an angel? There's so many possibilities to explore especially with his fallen angel brothers and sisters. I just hope it doesn't become a gimmick to watch his antics in human form. I'd rather see a growing exploration of his character and a new arc for him.
Were you surprised Metatron tricked everyone? Will he be the big bad in Season 9?
Carissa: Not really, he was too easy. The whole going to lunch thing after a hundred of years of being stuck in a hotel room? Something stunk about that. I'm not sure I'm ready for him to be the big bad, so I hope they choose someone a bit more amusing. He's almost too sadistic without the charm. Even when Crowley was at his worst, he had a charm about him that let you suffer through his sadistic nature and give him a day pass, so to speak. Not so with Metatron. Plus, he sounds like a Transformer.
Carla: Yes. Absolutely. That twist was shocking and well done. I think either Metatron or Abbadon will be the new big bad.
Alice: Ooh, that’s a good question. Yes, I’m surprised that his plan was so disastrous for the angels, and he executed it so easily. It’s quite clever how he waited all those years for the right opportunity. As for being a big bad, I’m not sure. Seems like his plan has been successfully executed and his revenge is done. I think he’ll sit back and enjoy his isolation in Heaven.
Sean: I actually was surprised initially, but at the back of my mind I had a sneaking suspicion. I loved seeing him transform from the simple scribe to the calculating revenge seeker. I'm not sure if he will be the big bad, but I've got a feeling there's no way it is the last of Metatron. I really just want to know if we are ever going to see Supernatural's version of God at some point.
Any predictions on what's going to happen now that the angels have fallen from Heaven?
Carissa: It depends on whether when they fell they were dead on delivery. Did they fall to the sky burnt up little winged bodies? Did they fall and now will walk the earth hungry for revenge? Will Sam and Dean have a new group of restless people to work with to try to fight with to get heaven back? It was such an open ending. Did the world see them fall? Will Sam and Dean be forced to try to explain to the world what it was? With a friend in Benny, I'm sure Dean's probably kind of happy he didn't close the door to hell. They're going to need someone on their side and they've befriended demons before. Maybe demons are their next call to duty. I don't know, but I'm excited to find out.
Carla: Chaos. Epic chaos. Beyond that, I have no clue. I wouldn't even want to put forth a guess, because I don't even know where to start.
Alice: I figure that they aren’t going to take being separated from Heaven very well. The adjustment will be awful for most of them. They’re going to be every bit as aimless and disorganized on Earth as in Heaven. Someone is going to have to step forward and rally them or the chaos on Earth will be very bad. They had lost sight of their role to protect God’s creations, so maybe this is the exact wake-up call they need to set them back on track.
Sean: It's going to be a new world, that's for sure. And will the angels remember being angels? Are they dead? Are they human? Just wingless? I never thought we'd see something as dramatic as that ending, and it's certainly a game changer. Will the demons be able to run free now that the angels can't do anything? It's such a fascinating concept that I'm just excited for the premiere of season 9. Ugh, why is it so far away?
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